These discussions (and similar) tell me it would be a useful reference to have a chart with some comparison notes (particularly of differences) between different build and combat systems. Now, some are essentially whole cloth recreations with a notional idea of keeping some flavour from the predecessors, but some are close enough that differences are worth picking out.

Also, it does lead to some running in circles because some versions of the rules don't answer certain questions and others do, yet one cannot assume this was an accident.

In the end, all that THAT really means is that any ref is going to be picking and choosing his or her own version of things and sometimes porting things from other build systems or at least porting understandings (likely intentionally added or clarified) from other versions.

This is one of the issues that happens when a given setting has multiple variations over time (which is obviously a financial necessity).

On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 8:43 AM Postmark - postmark.design at btinternet.com (via tml list) <xxxxxx@simplelists.com> wrote:
On 20 Jun 2020, at 04:44, Thomas RUX <xxxxxx@comcast.net> wrote:


Hello again Postmark,
On 06/19/2020 8:14 AM Thomas RUX <xxxxxx@comcast.net> wrote:


Hello Postmark,

On 06/19/2020 5:30 AM Postmark - postmark.design at btinternet.com <xxxxxx@simplelists.com> wrote:


On 17 Jun 2020, at 03:42, Thomas RUX <xxxxxx@comcast.net> wrote:

The Model 4 computer is indeed 4 tons and draws 2 EP from the Power Plants output of 4 EP. The computer's EP does not require fuel. Here is the best example I can think of. You fill up the gas tank on a 1kw power generator and plug in some stuff like lights, TV,  and a small refrigerator that draw 0.5 kw. The items pulling power do not increase the fuel capacity of the generator.

Tom Rux 

Hi Tom,

That statement is easier to refute, it’s on High Guard p28.

The top of the page has the reminder that at TL15, EP equals tons of power plant and tons of fuel*.

The next line reminds us the EPs are used for computers And the bit below that reminds us that systems cannot be installed that cannot be powered (they cannot be installed in reserve**).

So in your example, items pulling power do increase the fuel usage and in standard LBB design, your fuel requirement is always usage for 1 month, ie 1 ton per EP.
There are, if I counted correctly, 28 hulls in S9. Two of the hulls are small craft leaving 26 starships. Of these remaining hulls 21 are TL 15 and their power plant fuel tonnage = their EP. The five hulls below are not TL 15.

The TL 9 J2 Scout/Courier CT Supplement 9 (S9) p. 11 is a Book 2 design. Book 2 does not use EP under CT LBB 5 HG 2e the ship has an EP of 2. The Power Plant 2 require 0.01 x 2 x 100 = 0.02 x 100  = 2 tons of fuel. Note that under CT LBB 5 HG 2e that the Scout/Courier can not have a a J2 drive until TL 11.

The J4 TL 10 Express Boat is another Book 2 which under CT LBB 5 HG 2e is not possible until TL 13. This craft has no power plant but it is capable of keeping two people alive for the approximately one week in jump space and per CT Supplement 7 p. 9 three additional days.

The 300-ton TL 14 Gazelle Close Escort, CT S9 p. 17, has a Power Plant 7 which requires 0.01 x 7 x 300 = 0.07 x 300 = 21 tons of fuel which matches the EP = 21.

The TL-12 800-ton Mercenary Cruiser, CT S9 p. 21, is a Book 2 design. The write-up lists that the ship has an EP of 24. The cruiser has a Power Plant 3 which requires 0.01 x 3 x 800 = 0.03 x 800 = 24 tons of fuel.

The 60,000 ton TL 14 Azhanti High Lightning Class Frontier Cruiser in CT S9 p. 31 power plant produces 3,000 EP. The cruiser has a Power Plant 5 which requires 0.01 x 5 x 60,000 = 0.05 x 60,000 = 3,000 tons of fuel.

My conclusion from four of the five non-TL 15 is that a power plant produces 1 EP per 1 ton of fuel does.
To recap in CT Supplement 9 the TL 9 Scout/Courier p. 11 the Power Plant 2 requires requires 2 tons of fuel to operate for 4 weeks and produces 2 EP, TL 14 Close Escort p. 17 has a Power Plant 7 a fuel requires  of 21 tons and produces 21 EP, TL 12 Mercenary Cruiser p. 21 uses a Power Plant 3 that requires 24 tons of fuel to operate for 4 weeks, and TL 14 Frontier Cruiser p. 31 has a Power plant 5 requires 3,000 tons of fuel and produces an output of 3,000 EP. 

These four hulls clearly indicate to me that 1 ton of power plant fuel = 1 EP.

New material: CT LBB 5 HG 2e pp. 27-28 "Energy Points: Before installing computers or arming a ship, it is necessary to calculate the energy available to the ship. This calculations uses the formula E = 0.01 x M x Pn, where E equals the energy points available, M is the tonnage of the ship, and Pn is the power plant number."

TL 9 100 ton Scout/Courier with Power Plant 2 produces 0.01 x 100 x 2 = 1 x 2 = 2 EP. The power plant fuel tonnage is 1% x Ship tonnage x Power Plant Number = 0.01 x 100 x 2 = 1 x 2 = 2 tons of fuel.

TL 15 400 ton Survey Scout p. 13 has a Power Plant 3 which produces 0.01 x 400 x 3 = 4 x 3 = 12 EP. The power plant fuel requirement uses the same formula resulting in 12 tons of fuel.

From p. 28 "Note; At Tech level 15, energy points also equals the tons of the power plant and the tons of the power plant fuel required.

A Power Plant at TL 15 requires 1% of a hulls tonnage. The Survey Scout's Power Plant 3 is 0.01 x 400 x 3 = 4 x 3 = 12 tons. The Power Plant 3 requires 0.01 x 400 x 3 = 4 x 3 = 12 tons of fuel. The Power plants Energy Point Out put is 0.01 x 400 x 3 = 4 x 3 = 12.

The Note on p. 28 means that at TL 15 power plant EP is the same as the plants tonnage and fuel tonnage. In lower TLs power plant 1 ton of fuel produces 1 EP.

Note that these (correct) conclusions only apply to Book 5 designs.

Book 2 designs don’t use EP.
Book 2 power plant fuel is not related to EP: the book 2 scout with PP type A has PP2 and needs 20tons of PP fuel. Fit the same PP type A in a free trader and it becomes PP1, needing 10 tons of PP fuel.

Also, it is probably not a good idea to extrapolate anything about energy Usage from the combat system (even though that’s where I got the requirement for power for Jump from).
The rules are clearly intended as an approximation to speed combat resolution of large fleets - the only partial powering trade off is emergency agility, which assumes that computers need negligible power (true for battleships but not TL15 escorts and fighters) and either allows shields or not, depending on which page you read.
Plus you can’t trade weapons/shields/agility and don’t have to recalculate power after damage.

Example: the 50ton Heavy Fighter with PP-22 has 11 EP (1 for the laser, 7 for the Model/7 computer and 3 to provide Agility-6). Per the rules it has to suffer 17 points of PP damage before its Agility is reduced to 5. In practice this is irrelevant because the Fighter will be Fuel-0, Mn-0, Comp-0, Weapons-0 and crew-0 long before the power plant drops much below 22.

Phil Kitching

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